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SharpWind

Oblivion GEN 6.0

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Just now, SharpWind said:

beauty is in the eye of the beholder, my friend

you know something can be objectively bad right?

even if you find it good it looks fricking awful. can you stop deflecting criticism and acknowledge that what you are doing is wrong and it looks bad?

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51 minutes ago, SharpWind said:

Actually, the eyes on human beings appear nearly parralel, unless you're focusing on something which is an inch away from your face. 

i'm thrilled to inform you that it still looks odd and lifeless on blocky characters with blocky eyes, smartass. stop defending your work like you're some kinda god who does everything perfectly and accept criticism. everybody's saying almost the same thing but you're the only one defending it. you're making yourself look ridiculous with these excuses.

Edited by Cubic Ralsei

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Just now, Ian_The_One said:

you know something can be objectively bad right?

perhaps something like your attitude?

Let's not forget that Mine Imator is an animation software that makes minecraft animations. Mainly used by kids.

I'd understand if this was a Maya forum, where feedback was given by professionals, for the market, etc. But I've literally made the rig for a youtube video, gave it out for free and kids to use it in Minecraft animations. Can you stop for a seconds and listen to how absurd this whole situation has become?

I understand that lots of people dislike my style of shading, but why should that matter? It's my rig, not yours, and i prefer it this way

Now please, take a deep breath, we're talking about Minecraft animations here, not industry

4 minutes ago, Cubic Ralsei said:

stop defending your work like you're some kinda god

I don't think a "god" would fix things they've done wrong and give credit to others for showing them how it's done 🤔 (blocky bending)
because i don't want to fix certain things due to my preference, it doesn't make me an "egoistic god", it just means i have my own taste

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2 minutes ago, SharpWind said:

Now please, take a deep breath, we're talking about Minecraft animations here, not industry

Just because something isn't industry doesn't mean that it's quality doesn't matter 🥴

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1 minute ago, Frost said:

Just because something isn't industry doesn't mean that it's quality doesn't matter 🥴

I think it still makes a difference that i'm doing this completely as a hobby for kids who like minecraft animations on YouTube, pal.
You don't have to act like "quality police".

Again, like i've said. It's my rig, not yours. I understand you have your preferences, but i've made this rig off of mine

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:popcorn:

This was fun to read, but I think it's time to intervene.

I always try to take a step back and understand both sides of the argument. I definitely understand both points of view. On one hand, I agree with the others. The model itself is a bit uncanny and odd to look at, and the textures are objectively bad compared to something like vanilla Minecraft's textures, but this doesn't mean he has to listen to you. In the end, he can do what he wants. All we can do is give our opinions, and he can choose for himself if he wants to take them into consideration. 

People got defensive and aggressive on both sides, so there's no need to point fingers. How about we don't let this happen a third time?

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34 minutes ago, SharpWind said:

I think it still makes a difference that i'm doing this completely as a hobby for kids who like minecraft animations on YouTube, pal.
You don't have to act like "quality police".

Again, like i've said. It's my rig, not yours. I understand you have your preferences, but i've made this rig off of mine

Using "for kids" isn't an excuse to have poor quality. Take FuturisticHub for example. Look at how awful his animations are. They're obviously for kids and they're obviously terrible. Just because something is "for kids" doesn't mean it shouldn't be the best that it can be. If you really care about your audience, you'd step up the quality instead of doing the smaller amount of work because "they're just kids." 

Edited by TwoToRule
Accidentally forgot to mention FH

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3 minutes ago, SharpWind said:

Again, like i've said. It's my rig, not yours. I understand you have your preferences, but i've made this rig off of mine

If you are not willing to take any advice or criticism people give here, then you should just tell people on your next post that you don't want criticism. Because I haven't ever seen you consider any of it 😌

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9 minutes ago, TwoToRule said:

Using "for kids" isn't an excuse to have poor quality. Look at how awful his animations are. They're obviously for kids and they're obviously terrible. Just because something is "for kids" doesn't mean it shouldn't be the best that it can be. If you really care about your audience, you'd step up the quality instead of doing the smaller amount of work because "they're just kids." 

You're right, kids shouldn't be treated as "less demanding", but it's also not your job to push your opinions onto my work. At the end of the day, it's still my rig and i can adjust it based off feedback that i think would suit it. I don't have to listen to all of them.

Even if a million people are shouting at me, saying the textures are ugly, i simply dont feel the need to change them, because i like them. Once again, it's my craft. Please understand that.

9 minutes ago, Frost said:

If you are not willing to take any advice or criticism people give here, then you should just tell people on your next post that you don't want criticism. Because I haven't ever seen you consider any of it 😌

That's not true, sir. I've already adjusted two things on the rig because of feedback i've gotten here. I simply don't want to change the textures

Perhaps people here shouldn't give this much critisism unless being asked 🤔
Mine imator is supposed to be fun after all, people shouldnt have to deal with all they've done wrong in their work all the time

Edited by SharpWind
Added a sentence

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50 minutes ago, SharpWind said:

beauty is in the eye of the beholder, my friend

Then why did you post it here?

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26 minutes ago, SharpWind said:

Perhaps people here shouldn't give this much critisism unless being asked 🤔
Mine imator is supposed to be fun after all, people shouldnt have to deal with all they've done wrong in their work all the time

Unless you tell people not to give it, expect criticism on the forums.

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24 minutes ago, SharpWind said:

You're right, kids shouldn't be treated as "less demanding", but it's also not your job to push your opinions onto my work. At the end of the day, it's still my rig and i can adjust it based off feedback that i think would suit it. I don't have to listen to all of them.

Even if a million people are shouting at me, saying the textures are ugly, i simply dont feel the need to change them, because i like them. Once again, it's my craft. Please understand that.

1. I forgot to mention to mention FuturisticHub. When I was talking about "how awful his animations are," I was referring to him.

 

2. I never necessarily said anything about the textures on such. This reply wasn't meant for that. It was, however, meant to point out how bad your logic is. 

 

3. On the topic of textures, make new ones based on people's criticism. You may like the current textures, but you might like the new ones even more. If you don't, fine. You can go to the old ones. Just try to actually take people's suggestions into account before completely dismissing them. You never know, you might change your mind.

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Just now, Draco63 said:

Then why did you post it here?

Should i not share what I've done with other people? I thought that was the whole point of the community

Just now, Frost said:

Unless you tell people not to give it, expect criticism on the forums.

Why is it that people critisise others work and point out all the mistakes they've done by default? I'm sure if people wanted that, they'd specifically ask "is there anything i can improve?", as a lot of people do in my community. It's way less forceful

 

3 minutes ago, TwoToRule said:

1. I forgot to mention to mention FuturisticHub. When I was talking about "how awful his animations are," I was referring to him.

 

2. I never necessarily said anything about the textures on such. This reply wasn't meant for that. It was, however, meant to point out how bad your logic is. 

 

3. On the topic of textures, make new ones based on people's criticism. You may like the current textures, but you might like the new ones even more. If you don't, fine. You can go to the old ones. Just try to actually take people's suggestions into account before completely dismissing them. You never know, you might change your mind.

my logic, being good or bad, it still doesn't give anybody in here the authority over my rig. I made it this way, I like it, I dont feel like changing it, now take it or leave it. I've adjusted the things I've agreed with you on (such as the arm bug and blocky bending), but i like the textures the way they are. I don't owe you the new textures. This is what i've presented, now you can either use it, or you can not.

Why is it so hard to understand?

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2 minutes ago, SharpWind said:

Why is it that people critisise others work and point out all the mistakes they've done by default? I'm sure if people wanted that, they'd specifically ask "is there anything i can improve?", as a lot of people do in my community. It's way less forceful

We just want your work to improve 🥴

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1 minute ago, __Mine__ said:

Can you stop for a second and realise that every time this kind of situation has spiralled out of control, it's because of you constantly lashing out at everyone and completely refusing to take any kind of constructive criticism whatsoever?

No wonder people think you're so egotistical.

I want you to stop for a second.
Now read everything in the chat since the point when this quote was made.

This is a hobby. I've made the rigs for fun. I've adjusted a few things on it, because people didn't like it. I refuse to adjust the things i feel like wouldn't fit for my style. Yet somehow i'm egoistic.

Once again, this is my creation and you shouldn't act entiteled about changing it. I fixed what i agreed with you on, but I like my textures the way they are. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that and if you dont like how it looks, simply don't download the rig, simple

Just now, Frost said:

We just want your work to improve 🥴

Thank you for the kind gesture, and the tips you have given me so far, which i have fixed.
However, i don't like some of them, so you can stop trying to shove it onto my rig now. :)

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19 minutes ago, SharpWind said:

Should i not share what I've done with other people? I thought that was the whole point of the community

Why is it that people critisise others work and point out all the mistakes they've done by default? I'm sure if people wanted that, they'd specifically ask "is there anything i can improve?", as a lot of people do in my community. It's way less forceful

 

my logic, being good or bad, it still doesn't give anybody in here the authority over my rig. I made it this way, I like it, I dont feel like changing it, now take it or leave it. I've adjusted the things I've agreed with you on (such as the arm bug and blocky bending), but i like the textures the way they are. I don't owe you the new textures. This is what i've presented, now you can either use it, or you can not.

Why is it so hard to understand?

I am not asking for new textures. What I'm saying is that you should make new textures for your own benefit, because you might decide you like them when you see them visualized. I personally don't care about the textures, as I don't really have a problem with them, but you should really try something before saying you prefer what you already have. You don't even have something to compare it to, so how do you know it couldn't be better? There's a difference between good and amazing.

 

Once again, you have completely missed the point I was trying to make. It seems to me that whenever someone says something you think you disagree with, you immediately make up your own meaning of the words they say and then criticize them on that fake meaning. Now, I've been trying to stay somewhat neutral, but I honestly can't even seem to do that without you jumping the gun. I don't even think you're trying to hear people out, no matter what they say. And what you do say you have taken into consideration are things that you already wanted to change. For example, the bending. You said, and I quote, "I've actually fixed the bending elbows, because they were disturbing me as well, someone in my Discord server showed me how to get around the issues i've had." That's not you taking constructive criticism. That's you fixing a problem that you were having with the help of someone else. I better hope that isn't one of the "two things you have adjusted because of feedback you've gotten here" (In roughly your words), because it doesn't count.

 

Edit: That is one of the things you have "taken into account," as well as fixing a bug. Again, that isn't taking feedback. That's fixing a problem you knew you had from the beginning.

Edited by TwoToRule

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1 minute ago, TwoToRule said:

I am not asking for new textures. What I'm saying is that you should make new textures for your own benefit, because you might decide you like them when you see them visualized. I personally don't care about the textures, as I don't really have a problem with them, but you should really try something before saying you prefer what you already have. You don't even have something to compare it to, so how do you know it couldn't be better? There's a difference between good and amazing.

 

Once again, you have completely missed the point I was trying to make. It seems to me that whenever someone says something you think you disagree with, you immediately make up your own meaning of the words they say and then criticize them on that fake meaning. Now, I've been trying to stay somewhat neutral, but I honestly can't even seem to do that without you jumping the gun. I don't even think you're trying to hear people out, no matter what they say. And what you do say you have taken into consideration are things that you already wanted to change. For example, the bending. You said, and I quote, "I've actually fixed the bending elbows, because they were disturbing me as well, someone in my Discord server showed me how to get around the issues i've had." That's not you taking constructive criticism. That's you fixing a problem that you were having with the help of someone else. I better hope that isn't one of the "two things you have adjusted because of feedback you've gotten here" (In roughly your words), because it doesn't count.

i see your point, and i agree that making the textures would benefit me, however i've got a lot of things going on in real life at the moment (as i said, this is just a hobby). College, job, girlfriend, bills, as well as a couple of projects i'm working on with a team, who needs a motion graphics artist for a launching app.

What i'm saying is, i like the textures enough not to go back and redo them. Never said they're perfect, but they're good enough and it's not worth going back just for that.

As far as "missing hte point" go, it's not exactly easy getting it, when you've got a bunch of salty people calling you egoistic, because you only fixed some of the stuff they didn't like. A lot of times, the feedback in here can be very aggressive, targeted and entitled. I'm not even attacking / defending against anyone, i'm simply explaining that people's aggression is uncalled for (don't even try to tell me that "no wonder people think you're egoistic" and "stop defending your work like you're some kinda god" aren't biased, targeted messages)

The message comes acress way nicer and clearer in a sensible tone and now that i understand your point of view, i have to say i completely agree, redoing the textures would do me good. It's still practice at the end. But i'll have to decline as it's not an essential change to the rig and i've got too much going on for me at the moment

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    I might as well give my opinion on this even though the situation is incredibly stupid.

    I do agree with some of the people who are mentioning that there are things off about the rig. I have a few opinions myself about how the rig looks, but that's not the important thing here anymore. 

    Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but I don't agree with the people who are trying to force Sharp to take it and use it. People don't have to take your advice even if it may be true to some extent. Yes, people should take your advice into mind, but you can't force them to apply it to their work. Being aggressive about him not taking it isn't going to make him want to take it anymore than before. It's only going to make him want to take it less seriously. If someone won't take your criticism then move on and don't try to bother with them. That's what people should do instead of trying to force it on someone. While yes, I do understand that he posted it to the forum and should have expected someone to comment on it I don't believe people should have been so aggressive about the fact he wasn't taking it. You are wasting your time if you're trying to convince him to change something he doesn't want to change. 

    And to people suggesting that he should have stated he didn't want criticism, we all know that wouldn't work. I've been in the community long enough to know that people will believe that he is being sensitive or whiny if he states he didn't want anyone to comment advice on it. From my experiences, in and out of this community, people tend to ignore that and will still give you criticism. So, telling him that he should have mentioned that he didn't want people to give criticism on it is flawed.

    I believe both sides are in the wrong here. Sharp should have been more open towards those who gave him genuine criticism without trying to force it down his throat. Though, I also think that the people who were trying to force him to take it and stating that he was egotistical and that he believes he's a god were in the wrong as well. You do not have to attack a person to get them to accept your opinions or advice on their creations. Be civil about it. 


     TDLR: Both sides were in the wrong. Sharp should have been more open when it came to the people giving constructive criticism but some of you guys shouldn't have been as aggressive as you were. Don't waste your time giving criticism to people who don't want it. 

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On 10/17/2020 at 8:04 PM, SharpWind said:

I want you to stop for a second.
Now read everything in the chat since the point when this quote was made.

This is a hobby. I've made the rigs for fun. I've adjusted a few things on it, because people didn't like it. I refuse to adjust the things i feel like wouldn't fit for my style. Yet somehow i'm egoistic.

Once again, this is my creation and you shouldn't act entiteled about changing it. I fixed what i agreed with you on, but I like my textures the way they are. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that and if you dont like how it looks, simply don't download the rig, simple

Thank you for the kind gesture, and the tips you have given me so far, which i have fixed.
However, i don't like some of them, so you can stop trying to shove it onto my rig now. :)

I've since deleted my previous comment as I realise it was totally unconstructive and too harsh, and for that I can only apologise.

However, I still stand by my point that you really need to handle criticism better, regardless of whether you want it or not. While a lot of others here were definitely way too harsh and forceful now that I look back at the comments, your handling of them was not much better, calling people "entitled" and "biased" for disagreeing with your style. I am not entitled. Far from it, in fact.
Name-calling, whether it be from you or from others, is not civil, accomplishes nothing and just allows the whole situation to spiral out of control like it has done now.

Also, none of the criticism is "targeted" in the slightest.
If this exact same model were made by literally anyone else, whether they be popular or controversial, multi-thousand-repped or in the negatives, it would receive the exact same criticism. It has nothing to do with the fact you made it.

I get that it's nothing more than a hobby and that everyone is entitled to their own styles and opinions, but just realise that although they have different (and sometimes downright terrible) ways of showing it, everyone here is only trying to help.
For one thing, if someone is suggesting you change something about your model, kindly thank them for the feedback while explaining why you prefer your own style over their suggestion, then leave it at that. If they argue with your reasoning, they are the one in the wrong for not respecting your preferences, but if you then argue back, you are opening yourself up to also being in the wrong alongside them. Two wrongs don't make a right.

You don't absolutely have to retaliate every single time someone disagrees with you, and likewise, everyone else should not retaliate back if you disagree with them, because that is exactly how situations like this happen. A simple disagreement or two quickly turns into name-calling and insults, and achieves nothing but hurt feelings for everyone involved.

So I've admitted some wrongdoing on my end and apologised, now it's time for you to do the same.

We all started off being neutral and civil towards each other. So let's just end this here, forget this all happened and all go back to being nice to each other, shall we? Grudges suck.

Edited by __Mine__

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Jeez what happen here? both party seems to be taking it very poorly.
anyway, here's My perspective on this situation.
Sharpwind could be a bit more mature with His responses and He also have the right to ignore some criticism instead of replying to
every single one of Them, I agree with that, after all, replying to every single criticism is a waste of time, and I don't see the point on replying to criticism that You don't agree with.
Although The Critic is also taking this very poorly, like please, really toxic criticism isn't going to help anybody, it's just gonna make the creator feel attacked.
I also want to bring out that this is art, Everyone has their own intention on what They want to make, there's gonna be those who try making something unique by following the rules or breaking the rules.
Why I'm telling You this? Because We have to know that people have their own way of doing thing in art, We need to respect that, and if You want to go an extra mile, ask Them what They want to make, and try to give Them some advice directing Them to achieve the art that They want to make.
"You have to follow the rule, and if You break it, Your creation is bad" is a really simplistic view on Art, and everyone should be a bit more open-minded on Their criticism, ask Them what Their intention is, and try Your best to spot which one is a mistake and which one is a stylistic choices, and You can also deliver it in a polite way, without making it feels personal (wow a polite advice, what a suprised)

About the rig? well that....I kinda don't have time for that right now  xD
 

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